Select language:     » Introduction   Online Postcards   » Pick up a card   » Send a card   Monthly Poll   » Enter current poll   » View previous polls   Charts   » Album Charts   » Single Charts   » Musicvideo Charts   » Song Charts   » Remix Charts   Live Chat-room   » Login   » Register your nick   Mailinglist   » Sign up   » Member service   » View memberlist   Message Board   » Board rules   » Enter board   Guestbook   » View guestbook   » Sign guestbook Interactive  [Message Board] Prev 1 2 3 4 Next 20th Reply A.T.L. Banned: 1 time(s) Registered User Post: 55 Posted 05-12-01 - 05:22 PM My MP3 version is burned as first ... (just 1 day after the release date) ... I still have NOT the album as official one ... but I will keep on trying to get it!!!!!!!!!!!! One thing I wanna say with burning CD's: If you burn CD's ... and you do like it ... then you need to BUY the official ones too!!! Thats what I am always doing!!! I guess that is the best way of using MP3's! See Ya! SINTERKLAAS :P 21st Reply Myra Reporter Assistant Post: 35 Posted 05-12-01 - 09:39 PM now now... what's that conversation?? don't you know that's illegal? both in real life as well as on the board... I hate to be the one always complaining about this kinda things, but... it seems to be that someone has to remind about it every now and then. and ATL, Sinterklaas, is it Santa Claus in Dutch/Frisian? how come that signature? planning to give self-burned albums to friends on xmas? ///Myra 22nd Reply A.T.L. Banned: 1 time(s) Registered User Post: 56 Posted 05-12-01 - 11:25 PM Sinterklaas: COMPLETELY NOT LIKE that fat figure as SANTA CLAUS! Santa Claus is a person which is created by the Dutch people who moved to AMERICA ... because here they had SINTERKLAAS ... there they created SANTA ... Sinterklaas has got BLACK helpers ... and Sinterklaas is a very very old man ... and is comming from SPAIN (the legend says) ... and he is giving all nice kids on the 5th of December presents because he has got his birthday on the 6th of December! Kids need to put their shoes near the chimney (or however it is in English) ... and then Sinterklaas will go with his white horse over the roofs ... and gives the kids presents in their shoes! It is ONLY a tradition in the Netherlands ... and it is more friendly then SANTA CLAUS ... For further information ... just mail me!!! Keep on smiling! Sinterklaas! :P ps: :P -> on MSN you got then a figure with his tongue out of his mouth! really funny to see (something like that figure in the chat of this site!) 23rd Reply Flasher T Registered User Post: 16 Posted 06-12-01 - 01:34 PM One: It's pretty sure that I will buy the official album. I don't mind giving my money to , even if most of it will go to SR. Two: Actually burning CD's is not illegal here for private use... it's only illegal to do it for profit. I think it's the same in Finland, no? Anyway, if it wasn't legal, the stores wouldn't sell burners freely. 24th Reply Myra Reporter Assistant Post: 37 Posted 06-12-01 - 07:37 PM The Finnish law-system is quite complicated when we come to this question. In theory burning mp3's to cd's is legal, but that is only for the artists that HAVE ALLOWED TO SPREAD THE SONGS AS MP3's. That is, in practise, it is illegal, since there's about 3 artists/bands in Finland that have allowed their music to be spread as mp3's. ofcourse burning cd's and getting mp3's is legal, since otherwise there wouldn't be cd-burners or mp3 players awailable. But you have to remember that has not allowed his music to be spread, so if you have got 's music on mp3's from the internet, they're illegal. and if you burn them, it's illegal. Even if they were for your own use. That is the law in Finland, I wouldn't know of any other countries. But for me something that here counts more than law (in a way) is 's thoughts, and as I know he wouldn't allow it, I don't want to do such things. but that's me. ///Myra Reporter & Assistant 25th Reply A.T.L. Banned: 1 time(s) Registered User Post: 60 Posted 06-12-01 - 09:59 PM Maybe it sounds stupid ... but the people in the NETHERLANDS are always seeing what to do in a way which cost less money ... The fact is that CD's are extremely expensive over here ... they cost more then 47,95 guilders ... If you burn CD's ... then you can get clean cd's for 1,40 guilders (or less) ... so what would you do in this case?! To be such a good girl or boy to buy the official CD's ... or to be the "bad boy/girl" to copy it?! I guess that every person would choose to copy it! Because to pay 46,55 guilders more then needfull ... noone will do that! SO I hope you understand also my point of view ... and don't forget ... artists don't earn that much money on CD's ... the most they earn on TOURING ... but okej ... they miss a little bit money Keep on smiling! Arjen 26th Reply Chrissan Registered User Post: 13 Posted 06-12-01 - 10:28 PM Hi. I have no idea how much 46,55 guilders is so I can't say anything about it. Here in Sweden the prices has gone UP just because of that you, ATL, are doing - copying protected stuff without the owners permission. I think you should think a little more... pay whatever you have to pay or get to pay a big bill from the record-companies if they catch you? Just a thought, cause no one goes safe anymore. And if you continue copy/burn I don't think it will get cheaper by the time... // Chrissan Swedish assistant and translator 27th Reply Aggie21 Registered User Post: 9 Posted 07-12-01 - 01:45 PM What do you think about sales-charts? Are they based on sales of the official or burned records? I think you'd like to see on a high place in the sales-chart or am I wrong? 28th Reply Flasher T Registered User Post: 17 Posted 07-12-01 - 04:59 PM I'm with ATL on this one. Here, an official CD costs an average of $15. A decent-quality CDR can be bought for less than a dollar. Considering that probably gets about ten cents off of every album sold... let's just say, I'd rather pay $30 for a concert ticket. Furthermore, I have never heard of anyone being prosecuted for _using_ pirate software. Distributing - sure. But if it was that strict, about 95% of all people who ever touched a keyboard would be in jail by now. My opinion is that with the labels taking over, music has gotten way too commercial. I would gladly pay twenty times the actual price of a signed poster, or pay a lot for a concet ticket. I'm much more reluctant to pay for the actual CD. I cannot believe that a mass-volume CD factory would have a higher production cost per CD than my burner. So out of those fifteen dollars, $14 goes to the label and what's left to the artist. I'm not against paying for 's music; I'm against paying an enormous amount of money to Stockholm Records. Sorry for turning this thread into something so political, but this strikes a nerve with me. 29th Reply Phoenix Registered User Post: 33 Posted 07-12-01 - 05:27 PM I perfectly understand artists' grievances about CD burners. And believe me if right now I had enough money, I would buy official CD's. But, I guess you can look at the situation from the other point of view. What about those who don't have enough money, and still want to have some album. Well, a year ago I was buying about 5 official CD's every mounth, sometimes even more (I'm musicoholic). But right now, I'm a poor student. My schedule is so tight that I don't have time to work even part time. My scholarship is enough only for books, food and transpartation. Sooo, if my sister didn't buy me Euro IV Ever, I would definetely get Mp3. And there are plenty like me. I started downloading music only about 7 mounth ago. Before that, I always bought official Cd's. I'm not against and not completely in favor of mp3. I guess it's inevitable. Soon, all mp3's would be for sale, and the same price with the CD. I guess it's the only solution for musicans (to legalize mp3 and sell the downloads). So while it's for free, and while I'm so poor :))))))) I guess I will get as much mp3 as I can. (but don't worry, it turned out, I don't need 's mp3 cause I already have everything, and I got it pretty much legaly.) 30th Reply Myra Reporter Assistant Post: 40 Posted 08-12-01 - 08:58 AM Ok, I kinda see your points there, but still I don't feel good about the issue. I'm not saying I never had any mp3's myself. I'm not perfect either, but there's something that I have to lecture about again... For you who think that the money paid for a CD comes from ONLY the expences of burning the cd, you're sooooo wrong! First, ofcourse the price includes the money to the artist and the producers and everyone involved in the album (bands, mixers, backgroundsingers...). Then, as you have a legal copy, it has also the covers. Printing the covers is not free either. And the designer wants his/her deal. Then ofcourse there are the expences of the CD's and copying them... but then... yes, I know the recordcompany takes quite a lot there, but just remember they get the money to support the artist, they use it for artist promotion and such, so it's not really too much. As they ship the album abroad, the importer takes money. You have to remember they get the expences on shipping the album and delivering it to the shops. The biggest part of the "cake" goes to the shops selling the album!! At least in Finland, the album price is about 16-17USD, and the shop takes about 30% of it!! so they could sell it a lot cheaper! since they don't get that much expences on selling the albums.. .they have to pay their personal, ofcourse, and it costs a bit to have the albums in store, but NOT THAT MUCH. I'm sure I have also forgotten a lot of things from the above, but that's a rough picture of what makes the albums so expensive. And, as people are copying the albums illegally, the expences grow, since then the amount coming to the people working on selling the album get smaller in comparision with the amounts of money used to make the album, and that way they have to make the album more expensive, to cover the expences. But, if you want this to be 's last album, please keep on copying it. That way you'll make sure his recordcompany/producers/importers won't afford to make another album... and I'm not sure if he'd even want to. ///Myra 31st Reply Flasher T Registered User Post: 20 Posted 08-12-01 - 09:14 AM Myra, you're missing the point of my argument. I consider the core of the problem to be the fact that we are forced to pay so much for _music_. Record companies should find ways to earn their money on lateral projects - concerts, merchandise, special services on the Net, etc. If they release the mp3's for free, more people will get to know 's music (I'm sure you have more than once in your life wanted to buy a CD of an artist you're interested in, but the price put you off). That means a larger number of fans willing to pay for posters, autographs, concerts, videos, access to a chat even with the artist, etc. I'm sure that if they do it right, it will serve to the benefit of everyone - the artist, the company (which will save a bundle on lawyers' salaries), and the fan. On another note. An hour ago I saw a commercial on MTV that I had never really payed attention to before. Magix Music Cleaning Lab - I'm sure you've seen it. "Clean up your records, tapes and mp3's and burn them on CD." Isn't it funny how a well-established company isn't afraid to advertise something so highly illegal on a pan-european TV channel? 32nd Reply A.T.L. Banned: 1 time(s) Registered User Post: 61 Posted 08-12-01 - 10:27 AM To go further were FLASHER T was ... and to react on MYRA her oppinion 1) The prices for the CD's for the shops are around the 23,00 guilders here ... they sell the CD's for 47.95 guilders (or more) ... but not because of the reason that MYRA gave! It is because they have to ask for this price!!! I know this because of I am very close with the CD-shop here in our town ... and I know that this is private information from that shop ... but it is true! They need to ask a price for it ... and that is that high price! They cannot decide to make the price much lower or much higher! There are special prices for CD's ... and they need to ask that for it!!! 2) Myra ... you're not looking that realistic on the topic! It is more difficult then you think! As FLASHER T says ... there are enough companies (like the Dutch company PHILIPS) who are advertising with COPYING cd's .... to be honest ... PHILIPS was the company who made the CD and the CD PLAYER ... and also the CD BURNER etc ... it is much to easy to burn CD's, and if the prices will stay that high ... then I am sure that there will be many more people who will burn CD's ... To be honest ... I am somone who first downloads song from the internet and then I will buy them in th CD-shops ... if I like the songs! I guess that we need to see the MP3 thing as a kind of promotional thing for artists! I guess that promotion by internet is very very important for them!!! And I also agree ... that I would pay very much more for a ticket for a concert of band which I just like ... then to pay 47,95 guilders for a CD ... For , ACE OF BASE and GIGI D'AGOSTINO it is different for me ... from them I buy all the records which I can find ... and would also pay more for it if the price is high ... And I wanna make for everyone clear that the people who are here saying that they are not for DOWNLOADING MP3's ... that they are doing it too! OW MAN OW MAN! Don't say you are such an angels! You are also "guilty" ... so stop saying you're against it while you are doing it!!! See ya! Arjen! 33rd Reply NetRoam Webmaster Administrator Post: 25 Posted 08-12-01 - 01:26 PM Alright! First of all ... it's amazing to see this many replies in a thread that actually started out as a question whether or not an Englishman could find the Greatest Hits cd somewhere! The subject has turned - hehe Anyway ... to come back to the whole burning cd's, album paying side of the discussion ... then I'd like to give my little statement to the development of this pretty long arguement here! Firstly ... the reason why people have invented the cd-burners might have been the fact that it would then be easier to store people's computer-data if they were to reformat or whatever. At the time they made them, I don't think they thought of the fact that mp3's, movies, applications and games had that big an impact in today's internet, and we have to admit it ... it's big and uncontrollable! But that still makes it illegal to burn or even download mp3's of the internet ... but let's face it! Almost everyone nowadays download mp3-files and there's nothing you can do about it. Then there's the question if people earn money from all the burning or if it is for private use only! In Denmark a lot think that it should be legal to be able to make a copy of a cd for private use, and I think that's fair! But we have to consider the fact that the artists miss out on a lot of money, when people downloads their music than if people bought their albums instead. Just think of all the expenses there are when the artist makes the record. He has to have access to the studios which costs a lot and he has to have the instruments or computer for it and such. Believe me, I've heard how much it cost a new Danish artist called Freedom when he released his first album, and that was very much! I agree with you people that people would pay a lot to come to an concert or to get posters or other merchandise, but I still think that the artist should be supported by buying his album instead of downloading it ... and I'm not gonna lie to you all. I also download songs, but if I like what I hear, I buy the album! That's who I am! If you just saw my collection ... well, Myra and Stingbat can comment to that! One thing I just find weird in this whole album paying/burning thing and that's ... if so many people are so interested in all over the world ... then why doesn't the record company who represents him in that country try to show him some support and promote his album there ... that way his album will be sold a whole lot more and that would mean that he will come out to more countries and be even more famous than he already is! Just look at other Swedish artists like Ace of Base, Rednex or The Cardigans ... they have been aired on all sorts of music programs like MTV, VIVA, VH1 or whatever because they have been promoted in more countries than Sweden (or Scandinavia for that matter) and I think that's what needs ... how many people have seen 's videos on MTV, VIVA, VH1 or Much Music in the states for that matter? And how often? Well, this was just my "little" input in this discussion! Everybody might not agree with me, but at least I've tried to clear this up a bit! :) Last but least I'd like to say that it's great to have some long and hard-to-solve discussions on the board ... great to see! Thanx! Be good everyone! Peace! /// NetRoam webmaster 34th Reply A.T.L. Banned: 1 time(s) Registered User Post: 62 Posted 08-12-01 - 02:14 PM About that thing NETROAM does not understands ... I asked STOCKHOLM RECORDS many times to release songs from also here ... but it is NOT up to STOCKHOLM RECORDS to release the songs ... it is mostly up to JIVE or UNIVERSAL! As people maybe know ... UNIVERSAL will not listen to "just a person" like me or someone else ... That is also the reason why here in the NETHERLANDS was no release of DEE her songs ... I contacted UNIVERSAL several times about it ... but they didn't want it! And do you remember the problems around ES IST NIE VORBEI here in the Netherlands?! It was that stupid EDEL which wouldn't release the song here because RADIO 538 and TMF wouldn't play the song and the video!!!!!!!!!!! We guessed that that was because of there were GERMAN lyrics in it ... So ... what to do?! ow yeah ... contacting RADIO STATIONS is also not working ... I know that from my own experience! See ya! Arjen 35th Reply Flasher T Registered User Post: 22 Posted 08-12-01 - 04:40 PM Anyone watch The Simpsons? Remember that episode where Homer designs a car for his brother's company? There was an excellent phrase in there, loosely "Stop TELLING the public what they want and ASK them what they want". The people in Universal are not professional musicians, or professional music listeners for that matter - they're professional managers. They have a concept of the real world and of current trends which is considerably far from reality. Want an example? Take E4E. The first single released - Life - is a typical track, gleefully accepted by us fans. But what if they were to release Loneliness first? I know that personally I would have made quite a stink about how isn't what he used to be (untill I heard the album that is), but it would have almost surely brought him more _new_ listeners and more MTV and radio playtime - because it's a truly great song that will appeal to a wider audience than just the people who like for that which makes him E-type. There's a Hallmark movie called "Mr. Music" (if I remember correctly). It's about an ailing label that gets a teenager for a vice president as a publicity stunt. In the end this teenager finds a no-name band, and takes their song to fame, rescuing the label in the process. Maybe Mr. Universal Records should take some time off and watch the movie. 36th Reply NetRoam Webmaster Administrator Post: 26 Posted 08-12-01 - 09:31 PM A.T.L. ... once again you haven't read my post correctly before replying! I wrote the following - "why doesn't the record company who represents him in that country try to show him some support and promote his album there" Isn't THAT easy to understand? Of course I know that Stockholm Records doesn't promote all over the world ... I've wrote that before in an earlier thread where Myra and I said that Stockholm Records only promoted in Scandinavia and then it was up to the other record companies (such as Universal Music & JIVE Records) who represent in other countries to promote him there, but I guess that's once again a thing you didn't notice in my thread, or how do you see that A.T.L.??? I have to say though that I completely understand that Es Ist Nie Vorbei wasn't released in the Netherlands or Germany for that matter ... and why? Simply because of the fact that Blümchen had another release out at that time (Ich Vermisse Dich - released in december 2000, if you didn't know!), so 2 Blümchen releases at the same time would be so incredibly stupid by Edel. Only thing to do is to keep contacting record companies and radio stations ... question is then if you've handled the situation about calling them the right way because if you may have been a bit pushy trying to get released, they don't want to listen to anyone. I think it takes a lot of good points and advantages to make them listen and to take action, and if they didn't feel persuaded, they just let it be! But keep fighting! We need 's records to be spread to the world! Alright ... that's enough from me for now! Godspeed! /// NetRoam webmaster 37th Reply A.T.L. Banned: 1 time(s) Registered User Post: 63 Posted 08-12-01 - 09:47 PM Hello NetRoam ... there was not any other release of BLUMCHEN here ... that would be the first one in years ... so ... excuse me that I need to correct you on that ... but there was NO OTHER SINGLE released here from BLUMCHEN ... and here only BLOSSEM was known ... not BLUMCHEN!!! There were other reasons why they didn't want to release ES IST NIE VORBEI! And those reasons were damned stupid! Because they said the song was NOT commercial enough! And with that they mean ofcourse that RADIO 538 (the most populair radio station for the yought) and TMF (a TV-channel who sends out video-clips ... better then MTV) wouldn't play the song ... and if you have NOT the support of those 2 ... then you can shake it as an artist! Its just that simple! And there is 1 man behind those 2 channels ... so ... And I can go on ... And where was the publicity around the song PRINCESS OF EGYPT?! and around HERE I GO AGAIN ??? or around ANGELS CRYING?! Princess of Egypt ... that song was released for 3 times ... all 3 times there was NOTHING what happened with the song ... but there was also NOT ANY promotion around it ... so ... And HERE I GO AGAIN was played a lot on a TV-channel where you need to call to and then insert a code ... and then they will play the video ... so it was quite a hit ... but not much played on RADIO 538 or TMF ... so ... And I can go on with this for all the singles (Except THIS IS THE WAY and SET THE WORLD ON FIRE) So ... See ya! Arjen 38th Reply Myra Reporter Assistant Post: 41 Posted 08-12-01 - 10:12 PM first to the copying records... I also said there that I'm not prefect, I have mp3's (but 99% of them I have also on a legal album FROM WHICH I have transformed the songs to mp3's cause I like to listen to music as being online) and I've seen Morten's collection.. he sure has a huge collection there.. but he's right about the fact that CD-burners were not created for copying music, they were first made to make storing files easier. How do you think, if the recordcompanies would release the albums as mp3's, how many people of those who'd download them would actually go to a concert or pay for a poster?? I really don't think it would be that many. And for ATL, about the price the shops take.. ofcourse it's not up to one single shop to decide the price! they can have about 2 dollar differences on the prices, but otherwise they all have the same price. That's also cause there are laws there... and something important I forgot on my list of how the price comes... there's also TAXES! at least in Finland the tax one pays for a cd is 22%!! I don't really care to talk with you about the issue anymore, since it seems to me that just as you keep on telling us that we don't get your points... you don't seem to get our points either (by US I mean the people that are against YOU, that is at least Morten and me). Are you even trying? If you don't care about the artist here, then why do you even come to the site? hoping to find new connections to get free music? Anyway, if we'd talk about the releases... ATL, I'd suggest you'd just keep on mailing different people at the recordcompany that releases in Holland. Ofcourse one person's requests don't really matter on the subject, but if you're really the only one asking about , then it might be the most wise decision for the company not to release it at all. Sorry to say. I'm having everything just fine in Finland, since even though Universal Finland once said to me that they had no interest or plans to bring to Finland, they are still doing that. I already know everyone at the company, and the woman taking care of his promotion even said to me on friday, that "as the phone rang, I just somehow knew it would be you... again" ha ha ha! I'm not sure if she was happy about it, though... ;) the world would be a better, nicer and happier place if people like you would just obey the rules and use all your money on MUSIC (I rather use my money on music than posters, btw) and make legal albums sell better and reduce the price so you wouldn't have anything to complain about anymore. Except the weather. And skin problems. ///Myra Reporter & Assistant 39th Reply NetRoam Webmaster Administrator Post: 27 Posted 08-12-01 - 10:35 PM Myra: About my collection-thingie ... It really IS a huge collection ... and it's all legal cd's - no burned ones! And you're also right that this topic / subject keeps on going in circles since some person seems to have trouble understanding our points here ... and to be perfectly honest ... I'm quite sick of repeating myself :) --- I actually thought I had more on my mind at this point, but my head is empty, so I'll write more later if I figure out anything! /// NetRoam webmaster Prev 1 2 3 4 Next